DENON Mc6000mk2

[mjdj1689]

Here is the ad for the controller in question http://www.dm-pro.eu/en/denondj/Product ... Controller staing clearly it works with mixvibes.

The part is at the bottom -

The MC6000MK2 also offers dual balanced mic inputs (with independent echo FX and EQ). Uncompromising professional balanced and non-balanced audio outs ensure source sound quality is world class, whether the DJ is playing a live radio gig, small house-party or a large festival stage. Being a 100%, fully MIDI compliant controller, the MC6000MK2 is unlimited in its ability to partner alternative DJ software solutions, natively supported by Serato DJ (full version)*, Virtual DJ* and Mixvibes Cross*. Denon DJ
supplied mappings ensure compatibility with Native Instruments Traktor software.

It does now work with all the other brands , here is the question I placed on denon and the rather odd reply I got,--

http://www.denondjforums.com/forums/vie ... 67&t=21121

[sylMV]

Sorry for this issue, and misunderstanding.

As a side note, this guy on Denon forum sounds like an asshole

But anyway, as explained many times here, Denon didn't get in contact with us before writing it's compatible with Cross, nor after to get this sorted...

As stated on their page for mixvibes support:

*Release timing of compatible third party software to be confirmed.

Then, we can all see they've never confirmed/disconfirmed anything ...
But the real point (from what i know so far) seems to be that they don't especially want to make it compatible, they're just using our name to grab some of our users...

You might have noticed Mixvibes never claimed the MC6000MK2 is natively compatible with Cross. Nothing prevent from using it, but you must make your own mapping (the former MC6000 mapping being a good start).

[daniel clark]

took slight exception to the remarks posted(on denon fourm) ,, hopefully my post on the denon fourm was adquate have to wait on a moderator to approve the reply/posting ,,

[DJ Vintage]

Assuming the reply came from a person from China, I'd try to read the meaning, not the words. His "joke" about the folks at Mixvibes being so happy with sales that they can now afford to rest in a peaceful, tropical island in a hammock was just that, imho, a joke. By the way, not a bad dream to be having LOL.

His core conclusion is right though in my opinion. I agree that one of the things that did make Mixvibes Cross stand out was the awesome mapping support. Other software gets shipped with controllers, or better put, almost ALL controllers get shipped with other people's software (except for the ones that paid to have their controllers mapped and an OEM LE version of Mixvibes Cross with it).

So, for someone to switch from whatever software came with their controller, they need to be able to use their controller with Mixvibes Cross. And most will not be inclined to switch from (for example) a controller with perfect Serato integration to the same controller with Mixvibes Cross, if that means having to mess around with making midi-mappings and testing, re-testing and optimizing them. I am pretty technical and I know how I can make knobs and faders work, but there is more to it, especially the feedback from the software to the controller (lights) is definitely more than an easy job. And I just can't spare the time or energy to learn all this stuff just so I can make the mapping for ONE controller. At Mixvibes though, you guys know ALL about the mechanics of MIDI and HID integration. So your starting point is lightyears ahead of mine. You can do it faster and better than I ever could.

I understand that, currently, mapping support is not considered a number 1 priority at Mixvibes, and that is ok. You run your company the way you seem fit, I would too in your shoes.

And I also understand that it might be impossible to make mappings for every controller coming out (if only because you need physical access to one in order to make a mapping and you'd end up with a really big warehouse full of almost new controllers :-) ).

However, if we look at the high end controllers, the amount of them isn't all that big. Say max. 2 per brand and maybe 5-6 brands. Total of 10-12 controllers. This is all-in-one controllers, not mediaplayers, but same applies there.

Those are the controllers to be found in the hands of bread-and-butter DJs. The guys that go out and play (paid) gigs on a regular basis. The guys that have people looking over their shoulder in the booth (especially new DJs) to see what software they are using. Guys (and gals of course) that need their controller to be a plug-and-play piece of equipment, a tool for their trade that they don't need to fiddle around with to get working properly. Those guys are not techies, they are working DJs. They are not bedroom DJs (no disrespect, we all started there) and/or hobbyists that love sitting at their computer and figure this stuff out for hours and hours. And they will take not only the easy, but especillay the RELIABLE route in choosing their gear and software.

I will get in touch with the OP and FigDJ to see how we can resolve this for the MC6000.

But all specific controllers aside, I am truly convinced (and the person over at the Denon forum pretty much said the same thing) that from a marketing point of view, one of the things that can move market penetration of Mixvibes Cross forward as a serious alternative for Traktor, Serato or VDJ is that broad mapping support. Especially for the high end controllers.

Get the entire team of Manchester United to play in bright yellow Nike shoes, and 6 months later you can see half the people at your local soccer club playing on bright yellow Nike shoes. That is the nature of the human being. We follow and mimick our heroes.

It's not about the features. Mixvibes Cross has plenty of features and no doubt more coming. There are some very clever things in Cross not found elsewhere. I seriously love using it. So, the product is ready for the battle. The only thing it needs is to make it easier for customers to use their hardware with it.

Imho, supporting controllers is THE key for extended succes.

Keep it up guys and greetinx.

[daniel clark]

hopefully my reply on there fourm will get posted and even better it will spark some considerations on denon part to put a co joined effort to get the controller mapped ,, even a show of faith to send a controller and documation to ease the task of establishing a valid mapping thats would be in a perfect world , glad youu are willing to show effort with others on the same mission ,,applaud the efforts ,,and sorry all i can offer is a little lip service

[DJ Vintage]

Well, my reply on the forum got posted here:

http://www.denondjforums.com/forums/vie ... 72#p152172

Just to show that I am not just harassing you guys at Mixvibes, but across the road at Denon too

Greetinx.

[daniel clark]

good posting ,,

[FigDJ]

Good postings all around but i take offense on the following...

Those are the controllers to be found in the hands of bread-and-butter DJs. The guys that go out and play (paid) gigs on a regular basis. The guys that have people looking over their shoulder in the booth (especially new DJs) to see what software they are using. Guys (and gals of course) that need their controller to be a plug-and-play piece of equipment, a tool for their trade that they don't need to fiddle around with to get working properly. Those guys are not techies, they are working DJs. They are not bedroom DJs (no disrespect, we all started there) and/or hobbyists that love sitting at their computer and figure this stuff out for hours and hours. And they will take not only the easy, but especillay the RELIABLE route in choosing their gear and software.

I will get in touch with the OP and FigDJ to see how we can resolve this for the MC6000.

I am a club and mobile DJ with over 20 years or experience and I play regularly in clubs around DC, Miami, Orlando and San Juan, Puerto Rico. I am not just some "hobbyists that love sitting at their computer and figure this stuff out for hours and hours."

I offered my help to you and anyone else for the sake of personal satisfation and to help promote the software that i use. I am also an electrical and software engineer, yeah a techie. I think is a bit rude for you to gneralize the way that you have in your post.

You have have not even bought the controller yet so there is no way for me to help you out with a map without some testing. You say you would love to stick to Cross and also have not yet bought your new controller. Perfect opportunity to buy a supported controller. In my experience the DDJ family of controllers (DDJ-SX owner) is far superior to the Dennon MC6000MK2 that is just my preference. Do your research and open up your horizons to other brands of controllers since you have yet to spend the money anyway.

[RoJeC]

I don't think you should take it that personal.
IMHO vintage tries to get both MV as Denon in a cooperative state. The 'market' for MV likely is more in semi-pro and amateur. Not because of Cross lacking options but because pro's have there setup and are not always eager to make a switch (that's where you come in ...).
While aiming for that market a good relation with high-end equipment shows of to the equipment that is easier to afford. So the 'new DJ' has the perspective of future hardware investments with a tool he never has to step away from.

Which makes money for MV which makes it possible to quickly create a next Beta(..).

Enjoy the travelling. Sounds like a nice 'area' to make a living in.

[DJ Vintage]

Good postings all around but i take offense on the following...

My man, the last thing I want to do is offend you. As I stated in my PM I think it is great that you offered your help and I would be glad to accept it.

I am a club and mobile DJ with over 20 years or experience and I play regularly in clubs around DC, Miami, Orlando and San Juan, Puerto Rico. I am not just some "hobbyists that love sitting at their computer and figure this stuff out for hours and hours."

I didn't say you were. I was trying to make a more general comment on how the market has changed since the first days of Digital DJ-ing when (like in the early days of PC computing) people enjoyed spending hours to figure out what went on under the hood. These days people buy a PC, install software and use the tools. They don't care about registries, executables, command lines and such. There is a group of DJs entering the field now that are switching from analogue setups and that don't want to be bothered with making mappings (or learning how to). That's the guys that just want to buy the gear, start up the software and expect it to work. It's a sign of a maturing market in my opinion and it needs developers to adapt to the changes. It is no longer enough to have good features and rely on the user and the community to figure out the best way to let your product function with (in this case) controllers.

I offered my help to you and anyone else for the sake of personal satisfation and to help promote the software that i use. I am also an electrical and software engineer, yeah a techie. I think is a bit rude for you to gneralize the way that you have in your post.

I hope my previous comment took the chill out of the air on that one too. Me being denigrating about techies would be rather stupid (which I can guarantee you I am not). I have been in IT for 25+ years. I have been the hardware guy for clubs and a mobile company for many years, I was a radio-amateur way back. I can fix/assemble PC's, I can solve lots of IT-problems. I am pretty tech-savvy. So, no, I have no problem with techies. I consider myself more technical than many in my neigborhood. Again, the general thought here is that the guys that like the "under the hood" stuff are being replaced, in (large) numbers, by people that just want the working product and have no interest in why something might not work.

You have have not even bought the controller yet so there is no way for me to help you out with a map without some testing. You say you would love to stick to Cross and also have not yet bought your new controller. Perfect opportunity to buy a supported controller. In my experience the DDJ family of controllers (DDJ-SX owner) is far superior to the Dennon MC6000MK2 that is just my preference. Do your research and open up your horizons to other brands of controllers since you have yet to spend the money anyway.

I have spent many hours (actually took about half a year to decide) going over what I wanted and needed in a controller. When the MC6000 came out, it ticked all my boxes. Having used it for almost three year, I can safely say it's build quality is rivalled by non. Period. The thing is the veritable tank. It has everything I want and nothing that I don't need. I have a flightcase that it fits right into (no need to change that up either), I am used to the workflow and know where all the buttons are in the dark. Sure I can look at other controllers, but this isn't about the MC6000 per se. It's about not having the option of continuing with the software of your choice if you buy the follow up (not even a new model, just a mk2) and the makers of the software saying, sorry, if you want to use this high-end controller from a reputable vendor we are not gonna make a mapping for it. And that is hurtful because I personally believe that it will hurt the chances of Mixvibes in the marketplace.

Trust me, I wouldn't be spending all this time writing this stuff and doing the same over at Denon :-) if I thought it a trivial matter or couldn't care less. But I do. And if, in my enthusiasm I have phrased things that have caused you to be offended, my sincere apologies. Never intended that way.

@Rojec: thank you for your words. It pretty much sums it up.