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Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 30 Apr 2017, 09:48
by Hardly
I just picked up Cross DJ last week and have really been enjoying it.

That said, I'd really like to see an option to select tracks via Track Number # and file name.

Why this isn't in originally, I'm not sure, but I have a lot of albums where track sequence is very important and it's impossible for me to remember the actual order of the songs without looking them up online.

The TimeWriter - JigSaw Pieces, for instance, as a number of interludes, an intro and an outro but are not named as such.

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 30 Apr 2017, 10:30
by DJ Vintage
Not sure why Mixvibes didn't put it in, but I can tell you why I think that is the right choice.

We are DJs, we never play albums and if we do, the order of tracks is usually of no significance to the audience.

Personally I strip all track numbers from my tags and don't display the column in my list view. I will keep some album names, but only because these are tracks I might remember as being on a particular (often compilation) album. So I can search on album name and get all the tracks on it. What track# they were originally doesn't matter to me.

Same goes for filename. That's why we have DJ libraries, so we don't have to worry about the exact way a file name is set up.

At the end of the day, to me, it is about doing the proper preparation, have everything properly tagged in your software. Where you absolutely must have a certain number of tracks to be played in a specific order for whatever reason (could be album integrity or just for the music for a group of dancers doing a fixed routine), you can make a playlist, with the tracks in proper order.

So, imho, it's a non-feature for DJs. Clearly if you just want to use it as your extended media player to listen to albums then yeah, I could see how it would bother you.
Be interesting to have a poll to see how many people miss this option.

My two cents worth, as always.

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 30 Apr 2017, 10:57
by RoJeC
I agree with DJVintage. Track number might be of some relevance occasionally, but can usually better be solved by playlist.

For identifying and searching tracks the use of the tags are more the way to work than the limitations of a file name. Especially in Android you cannot easily change filenames with having serious impact on your library. The Android media system basically deletes the old name and adds the new name. So you may loose all entries of the old nmae, like listing in playlists, Cue settings etc. So modifying tags would be an easier way to go.
The tagging of files uses international standards for decades, whereas filenames don't follow any standard.

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 30 Apr 2017, 13:39
by Hardly
Then I wholeheartedly disagree with you for this reason.

I did college radio for almost five years and while, yes, vinyl tracks definitely don't need track numbers, the sheer amount of music in the collection I have, along with a huge numbr of CD only releases makes track numbrs a must, if only for propr organization.

Maybe a playlist works when you only have 200-300 of your favorite tracks you mix again and again, but when you have over 60,000 tracks in your database things get ugly really fast.

Coupled with compilaton releases with various artists, if you want to use two tracks in a row, such as the lead up to "dominoes" from Carl Craig, you simply can't.

I also didn't log onto the forum to get "opinions" from other users. The only reason i posted in here is because mixvibes contact page is broken and obviously they don't care to offer proper tech suppot

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 30 Apr 2017, 18:03
by RoJeC
Sorry you feel like this.
You're the first one reporting a problem with the contact page. As I mentioned in your other post. The contact page was updated with products that are out for some weeks only, so 'not caring' isn't an obvious conclusion.

Also this forum is in place for like 15 years to support users.

In the forum pro's and con's of suggestions are often discussed by users. If only because users haven't always discovered the features of the products.

The search function of Cross in the colllection is pretty good in reducing the number of tracks. WHen typing like 4 chars of the artist and 4 chars of the title you usually are back to a really short list.

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 30 Apr 2017, 20:18
by DJ Vintage
a) excuse us for living

b) this post mentions nothing about broken support pages, it's just an "it's unclear to me why this feature wasn't put in by Mixvibes and can you please fix that" question

c) as Rojec said, this is not the support pages, this is a user forum, so yes, you can expect user feedback (including opinions)

d) if you supply more information up front, you diminish the chance of people reacting to things that don't apply to your specific situation

e) you are the first person I hear of that claims to have about 600GB of music on his Android device. Good job, although one could question the wisdom of using an Android device for such a task. There are more full featured options on other platforms that do everything you want, including track numbers. It's a bit like trying to use an iPhone to DJ a gig at Ultra Miami, it can be done but it doesn't make much sense

f) I know quite a few (semi-)professional radio jocks. One of the things they spend a lot of time on is prepping their shows. Including gathering the correct playlist. It's not considered a hassle, but part of the job

g) Rojec is one of the best guys on this forum and a totally reasonable guy. Together with a few others they are the people that keep this forum running in the first place. So a little respect would go a long way here

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 02 May 2017, 09:17
by Hardly
Then allow me to apologize for not first having identified myself as a long-time technology and music enthusiast. I've been using computers since the C64 era and it obviously slipped my mind that maybe you've been dealing consumers of a lesser caliber.

The whole point of Track #'s, again, is to keep albums in the original order for which they were released. Sure, I could just grab what tracks I want to play, put them on my tablet and run with it, but that defeats the whole point of having a well organized library as well as killing any interaction with the audience.

What good are you, if, as a DJ, you are just going to mix a pre-chosen minimal set of tracks?

Moreover, what is the point of having access to Android's music library, when all users should simply then have to pre-configure their libraries before mixing anyway? (AKA a playlist.)

Probably the biggest reason I personally detest the lack of track numbers is this, though: When you have things in a certain order, specifically tracks on a album, and you shuffle all of those tracks and put them in alphabetical order, it becomes incredibly hard to just pick tracks like you used to.

Furthermore, I have a lot of tracks with non English names, including tracks in Japanese with actual lettering, that I cannot remember or even pronounce the name of the track, but I can remember the sound and choose it when I want to mix.

Finally, Cross DJ doesn't even sort alphabetically properly. Using the File Explorer, it put an album with a lower-case d at the very bottom of the list which makes no sense at all.

So here I am trying to find non-alphabetically organized songs, some of which aren't even in English or any kind of alphabet for that matter, but logical ordering and track #'s are CRUCIAL to what I do.

It wouldn't be bad if in the File Explorer Cross DJ at least showed the actual file name, because that I can set en-mass using software.

I could just duplicate my entire collection and re-encode track numbers onto the actual track names, I suppose, but with my collection in the range of 80gb (not 600gb like you propose) it'd be a huge amount of work...

And then everything is messed up when I want to play tracks normally in other applications on Android.

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 02 May 2017, 10:27
by DJ Vintage
I get it.

Of course everyone would like to have his/her favorite software tool to be as close to their desired workflow as possible.

My point was mainly that for MOST DJs (clearly exceptions confirm the rule) having access to track# is a non-issue.

Not because of pre-planned sets (never play one of those), but because they generally don't have to play anything in album order. I think I already said that for some older albums I used a lot in the vinyl/CD era, I like to keep album names, because I know " that" track is on "that" album. So find the album, find the track. If it was originally number 1, 6 or 22 on that album would matter little.

I can see how in other situations (and yes, albums in Japanese would certainly quality :-)) it could be handy to have track#.

You can expect a software developer to cater to the majority of the desires in the early releases, working their way to ever smaller group's wishes later on. Which is what I tried to convey, I understand why track# would not be among the first priorities.

For me tablets, smartphones are still in the "backup" category of DJ gear, although some of the software has become pretty grown-up. And more and more people are embracing them as their primary platform.

Final thought, you claimed 60.000 tracks. I think we can agree that the average 320MP3 track will be about 10MB in size. Simple math makes that 600GB. 80GB and 60.000 tracks would give you an average of about 1.3MB per tracks, which is 128MP3 or below. And I doubt a serious person like yourself would try using such low quality tracks for public performance.
So that is where that number came from.

On a general note: We are waiting for some major work done on the regular Cross for Mac/Windows, which has been side-tracked by the Remix series and the Android versions. I wouldn't mind if the available resources would now go into giving us win/mac users some much-needed upgrade.

Re: Sort By Track # / Filename

PostPosted: 02 May 2017, 11:44
by daniel clark
:idea: have you tried Cross for PC/mac ,, i think the filing system system might be to more of your liking ,, :cool: